What offenses they have committed against other people and they ask for forgiveness so by the time they get to the desert their hearts are clean they've they've confessed they've accepted they've forgiven each other that's a beautiful ritual right if you just did that you don't even need the coyote right but that's built up over centuries around this experience and i worry with us the way we are in in the western world it's like you know i met this dude i was at a friend's birthday party in a mexican restaurant in santa monica a few years ago,
And i was sitting at the table next to this guy and my buddy's like hey you should talk to chris he knows about psychedelics and like oh yeah what's up and he said yeah you know since i got back from afghanistan i've been having a lot of ptsd so i decided my girlfriend said i should take some ayahuasca i was like okay how's where are you going what are you going to do he's like oh tomorrow in in venice beach and they wanted me to stay for the weekend but i only have one night because i got to go to miami i got some stuff going on down there and oh and the guy's got a you know uh margarita in his hand and he's having a burrito or something,
And he's gonna go do ayahuasca the next day in venice i was like and he's like what you think it's a bad idea and i was like well it's not a magic pill right like there's a process around it like you don't drink alcohol or eat meat for a while you prepare you you know it's like anyway so that turns out it didn't go well uh somebody freaked out in the session and called the cops oh and they raided it and so everyone's tripping while the cops are oh my god so that's what i worry about it's not a magic pill oh my god that gave me chills man i mean when i was a teenager in in my 20s i used to go to a lot of dead shows you know and we'd take tons of acid here in vegas,
Actually went to one um funny enough las vegas would be the last place i would ever recommend somebody do any psychedelics yeah but there were i don't think well actually no once i did get bus i did get busted by the cops they threw us in the car we're frying on acid at a dead show in orange county i mean if you're in that vulnerable state and goes wrong it can go really wrong i mean luckily i live to tell the tale but when you said that i'm like oh god on ayahuasca it's like that is yeah just absolutely horrific so i i like the point that you raise and um you know i'm glad there are people like you that are the voice of reason you know the grumpy,
And i think i am too i mean uh you know my wife is a shaman and she's much more conservative even than i am and you know very infrequently um journeys and it's not even how she really um serves people but uh it is kind of i think we have to have temperance between enthusiasm and seeing what's possible and the excitement of this awakening that um is potentially there but also be very mindful of yeah of tradition and set and setting and all those things you kind of get sick of hearing people say yes and said yeah i get it but no really like for real set in setting and intention and the preparation and the aftercare respect yeah so thank you for bringing that to the conversation and most people that i've interviewed,
And we that we've touched on this stuff i mean i think all of them have had a reverence for these experiences in medicines because i'm especially something like 5m eodmt i mean you're rearranging your entire psyche in 10 minutes potentially that's how it's been for me and that's not something that i would just wander into willy-nilly oh i heard it's fun you know i mean things will never be the same in most cases after some of these deep experiences yeah hopefully for the better yeah well dude thank you so much yeah thank you awesome i'm so glad this finally this finally happened yeah i prefer to do my interviews in person,
You know and so sometimes it's like oh i got to wait till i'm going to be where they are i saw you on the bill here and i was like yes well i'm glad you reached out i i'm the same i i just passed 500 episodes i mentioned incredible uh i've been doing it for nine years or something and the first until covet i did only in person yeah um and that puts a cramp in it but it's a much better conversation i mean it's it's i think produces a better end i don't want to call it a product but say end experience for the listener or viewer but for me it's just way more fun right right if we were on this then and there's those subtle cues nonverbal communication,
There's nuances that are delayed by the internet connection and it's just kind of weird so glad we got to do it i do have one last question thank you yeah uh who have been three teachers or teachings that have influenced your life and your work that you might share with us oh three teachers or teachings well uh henry david thoreau who wrote walden famously and civil disobedience less well-known but equally important work i read that a long time ago probably 17 something like that and that really struck me there's a line in walden where he says uh a man's wealth is best measured by the things he can do without wow i've never forgotten that,
And over the years decades that i traveled around the world with a backpack and now in a van it's i'm very conscious of the wealth to be found in minimal needs that's been important my father was a great teacher for me both my parents really um in in that they you know they were married my dad died uh three years ago my mom's still around she handles the merch for my podcast are you serious oh yeah oh that's cool yeah she's at the end there's a thing where i talk to her and she's like well we've got t-shirts and we've got stickers oh that's awesome yeah but anyway they were married they were monogamous they were in love,
It was they met in high school it was like you know 50s late 50s um and they were totally unthreatened by me having a very different kind of life you know my dad had a job and he was successful and mortgages and all that suburban life but they never felt that my divergence from their reality was in any way uh um it gets back to what you were saying earlier like you can love chocolate and not hate vanilla they always got that instinctively and they're like okay you're a weirdo you want to go you know hitchhike to alaska with a backpack and work on a fishing boat well good for you have fun be careful but they never were like you're wrong you're wasting your education,
You have to be like us to be right yeah they always are like it's your life do what you need to do we got your back as much as we can and we love you no matter what and that was awesome um so yeah i would say they were two very important teachers and honestly i mean you know i i see psychedelics you mentioned the zapotec earlier they refer to piyote as el maestro the teacher and i feel that psychedelics have been for me a mentor in a way and i've learned a lot from access to them and the states of consciousness that that they helped me identify so if that's possible it's topical here at medellin i i would agree 100 100 yeah it's almost i view the medicines is kind of i've never looked at it like oh it's the teacher but it's sort of it's like they're they offer a portal into the teaching capital,
You know what i mean it's like they're an access point that kind of lift the veil and give us access to a greater scope of wisdom and understanding you know they're kind of like a distraction almost like hey look over there they're just going it's over there it's over there but give you the eyes to see right yeah i remember reading a line somewhere that a great teacher is not concerned with conveying information they're concerned with creating a space in which learning is possible bingo beautiful yeah very cool uh where can people find your books websites all that stuff we'll put in the show uh that chrisryan.com it's all there cool awesome man thank you.
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